I don’t think it’s a stupid comment at all Barley Water. As a matter of fact I’m still considering increasing the bittering hops just a bit. After drinking a few I do feel like the mash temp should be lower. Malty I have…needs to be a bit more dry.
Still all things considered I’m happy with it as my first lager attempt and it’s a good starting point for future ones.
@worts worth - The only way for us to truly know whether the slow cool or crash cool is better is to do 10G and split the batch, changing only the cooling procedure. Would be interesting, but the consensus is split. I am in the crash cool camp.
Barely Water is right, the balancing act of malty but not sweet is the hardest thing to nail in an Ofest. To me, mash temp is less critical than we suspect. I think pH could be the driver here. I think the german guys go much lower than us, mashing at 5.2 and aiming lower in the fermenter. It is my opinion the reason some guys like decoction mashes is because it lowers pH further than infusion. Never measured it, but would wager an Ofest mash with a pH of 5.4 (like most beers) decocted would get down to 5.2 after all the boiling… Lower mash pH favors (edit BETA) BUT ALSO perceived crispness in the final beer. Lastly, lager yeasts are well documented to NOT lower pH as ales yeasts so there is less of a concern about creating overly acidic beer with a lower mash pH.
[quote=“Worts_Worth”][quote=“Denny”]I’m about to try this…http://brulosophy.com/lager-method/
Chill wort to pitching temp (48°-53°F), pitch adequately sized starter (decanted), set regulator to initial fermentation temp (50°-55°F), and leave beer to ferment 5 days. (+5 days)
On the morning of the 5th day (beer should be over 50% attenuated), remove probe from side of fermentor so it measures ambient temp inside chamber and bump regulator up 3°-5°F; continue raising ambient temp 3°-5°F every 12 hours until you reach 65°F then leave it for 2-3 days to finish fermenting and cleaning up. (+5 days = 10 days)
On day 11, start ramping the ambient temp of the chamber down 5°F every 12 hours until it reaches 30°F and let it cold crash/lager for 3-4 more days. (+8 days = 18 days)
Rack cold (and usually very clear) beer to kegs, put kegs in kegerator/keezer on gas, leave for a week, serve! (+7 days = 24 days)[/quote]
I was intrigued by this when I first saw it, and decided to go ahead and try it with a Chech Pils. I’m now in the process of dialing my temp down after the D-rest, and my converted wine-fridge fermentation chamber can only go down to the low 40s. Will that be problematic? Should I fine with some gelatin to help clear the lager? Or more drastically, move some kegs around and use my chest freezer as a makeshift fermention chamber?[/quote]
Low 40s may take a bit longer, but it should be fine.
Should be interesting to see how my schwarzbier turns out then. I mashed at 151 and shot for 5.4pH but ended up with a pre-boil kettle pH of 5.3.
That might work well with the dark malts. What did you do for the Ofest?
153 and 5.5 because I wanted body and malt forward profile. By all counts it’s still a very young lager but I can see how a lower mash temp and pH could refine it.
I really want to make a pilsner over the winter but I’m not sure I’m ready for that challenge yet so I bought a 12 of the totally closed box Urquell this morning to get my fix.
[quote=“zwiller”]@worts worth - The only way for us to truly know whether the slow cool or crash cool is better is to do 10G and split the batch, changing only the cooling procedure. Would be interesting, but the consensus is split. I am in the crash cool camp.
Barely Water is right, the balancing act of malty but not sweet is the hardest thing to nail in an Ofest. To me, mash temp is less critical than we suspect. I think pH could be the driver here. I think the german guys go much lower than us, mashing at 5.2 and aiming lower in the fermenter. It is my opinion the reason some guys like decoction mashes is because it lowers pH further than infusion. Never measured it, but would wager an Ofest mash with a pH of 5.4 (like most beers) decocted would get down to 5.2 after all the boiling… Lower mash pH favors alpha BUT ALSO perceived crispness in the final beer. Lastly, lager yeasts are well documented to NOT lower pH as ales yeasts so there is less of a concern about creating overly acidic beer with a lower mash pH.[/quote]
I also read somewhere recently, Brad Smith’s newsletter I think, that dark munich doesn’t have as high diastatic power as the lighter munich and won’t convert as fermentable. Anyone have any insight on that?
With continental Munich, that’s true, although it’s not a huge difference. With the domestic GW Munich 10L I use for Am. styles, it has plenty of diastatic power.
With continental Munich, that’s true, although it’s not a huge difference. With the domestic GW Munich 10L I use for Am. styles, it has plenty of diastatic power.[/quote]
This Ofest recipe was almost 40% avangard munich 20L. I can’t seem to find any info specific to the degree Lintner of that malt but everything I see says light munich 70, dark munich 25. At 25 it’s not self converting correct? Mashed with 4 lbs pils and 2 lbs Vienna though.
With continental Munich, that’s true, although it’s not a huge difference. With the domestic GW Munich 10L I use for Am. styles, it has plenty of diastatic power.[/quote]
This Ofest recipe was almost 40% avangard munich 20L. I can’t seem to find any info specific to the degree Lintner of that malt but everything I see says light munich 70, dark munich 25. At 25 it’s not self converting correct? Mashed with 4 lbs pils and 2 lbs Vienna though.[/quote]
IIRC, 25 should be self converting…just barely.
I cannot imagine the pils not converting what the munich did not convert itself. I only think that’s a factor with much higher percentages. I wanted to add that I have done mashes @ 160F with 10% crystal and got dry beer. Mashed at 5.3 though…
“Mashweasel” Kirsten England posted a ton of good info on Ofests back in the day. He won AHA national with his Ofest with 100% vienna (decocted). He recommends 80-90% vienna, 10-20% dark munich for infusion. (I think it might need acid malt for pH)
[quote=“zwiller”]I cannot imagine the pils not converting what the munich did not convert itself. I only think that’s a factor with much higher percentages. I wanted to add that I have done mashes @ 160F with 10% crystal and got dry beer. Mashed at 5.3 though…
“Mashweasel” Kirsten England posted a ton of good info on Ofests back in the day. He won AHA national with his Ofest with 100% vienna (decocted). He recommends 80-90% vienna, 10-20% dark munich for infusion. (I think it might need acid malt for pH)[/quote]
I just tapped a ‘Mocktoberfest’ ale brewed with the same recipe but subbed Wy1007 german ale yeast for the lager yeast, fermented at 60 degrees. Turned out pretty good. Tastes a lot like Sam Adams’ Ofest to me.
When I brew the Ofest again I’ll likely reduce the Munich a bit and increase the pils as well as mashing at 151 and maybe lower pH too.
With continental Munich, that’s true, although it’s not a huge difference. With the domestic GW Munich 10L I use for Am. styles, it has plenty of diastatic power.[/quote]
This Ofest recipe was almost 40% avangard munich 20L. I can’t seem to find any info specific to the degree Lintner of that malt but everything I see says light munich 70, dark munich 25. At 25 it’s not self converting correct? Mashed with 4 lbs pils and 2 lbs Vienna though.[/quote]
Time and a mash targeted towards fermentability should help convert dark munich, but if it’s only a percentage of your grist with higher diastatic power malts, it shouldn’t be anything to worry about.
