Hops in a Muslim bag?

[ickyfoot]

Regarding the original topic, the feedback is useful for me as I’m considering using hops bags in my boil. I do like seeing them roll around the kettle, but don’t like having the leaves clog the valve when I drain. Might try one tomorrow and see how it goes.

I guess since I’m anti-religious all around

Anti-religious? How is that different from religious person A being anti-religious person B? That always confused me about some of the more fanatical atheists (Richard Dawkins being a prime example). Oh, the dichotomy!

I do agree that beliefs can be quite odd. Personally, I see generally see the major religions as the remnants of fallen governments wrapped up in rather intriguing cultural elements.

As for religious jokes, I was raised Jewish, and there’s nothing kids in Hebrew school like more than terrible Jewish jokes. Now, religious jokes just fall flat for me. They’re like the BMC of humor .

IMO, you really ought to add “IMO” to these sort of statements

To be fair, he did say “Just my 2 cents”.

[wrathius]

I laughed. I’m so sick of political correctness I really don’t care. Tell jokes and move on, don’t take it personally.

[ickyfoot]

I’m anything but PC. I tend to be pretty offensive and appallingly vulgar, actually.

I just tend to play that down around people I don’t know, especially the latter. I also try to avoid cliches, especially when they perpetuate fairly damaging blanket portrayals of over 2 billion people.

[thetooth]

@Wrathius

I laughed. I’m so sick of political correctness I really don’t care. Tell jokes and move on, don’t take it personally.

+1… I sensed an overreaction to some jokes that I didn’t think had any venom behind them.

[beersk]

@ickyfoot

I guess since I’m anti-religious all around

Anti-religious? How is that different from religious person A being anti-religious person B? That always confused me about some of the more fanatical atheists (Richard Dawkins being a prime example). Oh, the dichotomy!

I do agree that beliefs can be quite odd. Personally, I see generally see the major religions as the remnants of fallen governments wrapped up in rather intriguing cultural elements.

As for religious jokes, I was raised Jewish, and there’s nothing kids in Hebrew school like more than terrible Jewish jokes. Now, religious jokes just fall flat for me. They’re like the BMC of humor .

Richard Dawkins actually claims to be more agnostic than atheist. He says it is unscientific to claim to know that there is NO GOD. But in addition to that he says that the probability is in the favor of no god. ANYWAY…

I’m not an atheist either. Just because some one is anti-religious doesn’t make them atheist. I think militant atheists are rather annoying also, even though I agree more with their agenda than with fundamentalist christians.
Unlike atheists, I strike to rid faith and religion from my life. Atheists still have faith in no god.

But I like your take on religions being remnants of fallen governments, that’s an interesting thought…

[ickyfoot]

I didn’t think had any venom behind them.

The people making the jokes may not have meant any harm, but the instant gravitation towards portrayal of Muslims as bomb-happy lunatics is unwarranted and propagates a venomous myth, regardless of intent.

I realize I may take the concern to the extreme, but America has a history of, shall we say, mistreating “The Other” du jour, and it’s worth pushing back against mischaracterizations of groups dealing with that problem. Also, that portrayal of Muslims is seen as Truth by a sizable segment of our society, which shouldn’t be disregarded, imo.

I dunno. My own family history (pogroms, holocaust) plays a role in how I see this, for sure. Call me paranoid, but human populations can go to very dark places.

Richard Dawkins actually claims to be more agnostic than atheist. He says it is unscientific to claim to know that there is NO GOD.

Really?! I have never come across this. Mostly I was just talking about his comments regarding religion being some evil driving force. In reality, religion, God, it all arises from us; what reason is there to think that eradicating “religion” means its darker aspects won’t surface in other forms? 10,000 years of human history suggest no such reason exists, and I find it odd that Dawkins, as an evolutionary biologist, would ignore this. I mean, just look at the Cultural Revolution or Stalinist Russia and what they did in pursuit of an atheist society. For me, the same concerns arise from anti-religion sentiments as those that arise from anti-Muslim, etc., sentiments.

Atheists still have faith in no god.

+1! It’s amazing how difficult it is to get an atheist to understand that.

[beersk]

@ickyfoot

[quote]I didn’t think had any venom behind them.

The people making the jokes may not have meant any harm, but the instant gravitation towards portrayal of Muslims as bomb-happy lunatics is unwarranted and propagates a venomous myth, regardless of intent.

I realize I may take the concern to the extreme, but America has a history of, shall we say, mistreating “The Other” du jour, and it’s worth pushing back against mischaracterizations of groups dealing with that problem. Also, that portrayal of Muslims is seen as Truth by a sizable segment of our society, which shouldn’t be disregarded, imo.

I dunno. My own family history (pogroms, holocaust) plays a role in how I see this, for sure. Call me paranoid, but human populations can go to very dark places.

Richard Dawkins actually claims to be more agnostic than atheist. He says it is unscientific to claim to know that there is NO GOD.

Really?! I have never come across this. Mostly I was just talking about his comments regarding religion being some evil driving force. In reality, religion, God, it all arises from us; what reason is there to think that eradicating “religion” means its darker aspects won’t surface in other forms? 10,000 years of human history suggest no such reason exists, and I find it odd that Dawkins, as an evolutionary biologist, would ignore this. I mean, just look at the Cultural Revolution or Stalinist Russia and what they did in pursuit of an atheist society. For me, the same concerns arise from anti-religion sentiments as those that arise from anti-Muslim, etc., sentiments.

Atheists still have faith in no god.

[/quote]
I’m not disagreeing with anything you’re saying. Richard Dawkins talks about the label of his belief in his books, specifically “The God Delusion”.
I just think if we can’t laugh as the faults of humanity, than that’s a pretty miserable way to live. Sure it’s stereotyping and pigeon-holing, but there’s also a measure of humor in it. The comments made weren’t made to be an attack, I don’t think. Maybe they were a bit immature, but so what…we’re all immature in our own ways.

@ickyfoot

+1! It’s amazing how difficult it is to get an atheist to understand that.

I guess I’m more evolved in my beliefs than most unbelievers.

The way I see it is, it doesn’t matter what you believe or what you think you “know” about the world, it doesn’t change anything and it doesn’t answer the questions we can never know. So, based on that “knowledge” or realization, I seek to rid myself of all religion.

I’m glad the moderators are still letting this thread live. It’s been civil and has taken a more mature direction.

[tom_sawyer]

[quote=“ickyfoot”]I’m anything but PC. I tend to be pretty offensive and appallingly vulgar, actually.

I just tend to play that down around people I don’t know, especially the latter. I also try to avoid cliches, especially when they perpetuate fairly damaging blanket portrayals of over 2 billion people.[/quote]
Only one billion. Muslim women don’t have bags.

[silentknyght]

@zwiller

Muslin bags are a waste. Let them hops move around and spread their love. Only time I would use one would be if I was keg hopping without a stainless tea ball. No use for them in dry hopping in a fermenter, after a week they usually fall out of suspension and you can rack off them. I would however rack to secondary if you wanted to harvest the yeast without all the extra hop mess…

What do you think about paint-strainer bags (via a hop spider)? If–as I’ve read–they don’t affect hop utilization, and they can be cleaned & reused, it would seem to be a wash as to whether you use one or not.

IIRC, muslin bags have a weak mesh and wouldn’t act nearly as nicely as a strainer.

[ickyfoot]

I just think if we can’t laugh as the faults of humanity, than that’s a pretty miserable way to live. Sure it’s stereotyping and pigeon-holing, but there’s also a measure of humor in it. The comments made weren’t made to be an attack, I don’t think. Maybe they were a bit immature, but so what…we’re all immature in our own ways.

Uh…yeah…see my comments re: being appallingly vulgar

I’m a huge fan of irony, I just think in the context of the war on terror and its the coinciding rise of rampant xenophobia and jingoism in America, Muslims could use a little break from the caricature of violent jihadist.

I guess I’m more evolved in my beliefs than most unbelievers.

At the very least, you’re less inclined to millennialism. Millennialism can be a dangerous thing, imo. And, I share your desire to eschew belief as much as possible, although I do make exceptions for things like most of the laws of physics, even though I haven’t personally tested them .

I don’t really have an interest of shedding all aspects of religion, though, as I think many of the cultural elements they have and continue to contribute are incredible.

[ickyfoot]

[quote]What do you think about paint-strainer bags (via a hop spider)? If–as I’ve read–they don’t affect hop utilization, and they can be cleaned & reused, it would seem to be a wash as to whether you use one or not.

IIRC, muslin bags have a weak mesh and wouldn’t act nearly as nicely as a strainer.[/quote]
Good points…they seem to be more accessible, too.

[thetooth]

[quote=“ickyfoot”][quote]What do you think about paint-strainer bags (via a hop spider)? If–as I’ve read–they don’t affect hop utilization, and they can be cleaned & reused, it would seem to be a wash as to whether you use one or not.

IIRC, muslin bags have a weak mesh and wouldn’t act nearly as nicely as a strainer.[/quote]
Good points…they seem to be more accessible, too.[/quote]

I’ve gotten away from hop bags and my utilization seems to be better. That works great for me with pellet hops, but I fear that I’ll have issues with leaf hops… so I’m thinking of trying the paint strainer bag as well. My question, though, is does the hop spider buy you more utilization than if you just tossed the bag into the kettle?

[beersk]

[quote=“ickyfoot”][quote]

I guess I’m more evolved in my beliefs than most unbelievers.

At the very least, you’re less inclined to millennialism. Millennialism can be a dangerous thing, imo. And, I share your desire to eschew belief as much as possible, although I do make exceptions for things like most of the laws of physics, even though I haven’t personally tested them .

[/quote][/quote]
I…don’t…think so. Besides I don’t like labels. Especially self-important sounding ones like “millennialist”, which has nothing to do with what I “believe” or don’t believe. Beliefs don’t change what we see, what we can know, the law of physics, etc. They might change how we perceive the world, but not how the world actually IS. I don’t need answers for everything mysterious, I don’t need or seek affirmation from anyone else with regards to politics or beliefs. It’s nice to be free.

Brew free or die! yargh! haha jk

Anyway, this was a fun discussion. I think it’s time to put it to bed. :cheers:

[ickyfoot]

Indeed. But, just to be clear, I wasn’t calling you a millennialist; quite the opposite!
:cheers:

[beersk]

[quote=“ickyfoot”]Indeed. But, just to be clear, I wasn’t calling you a millennialist; quite the opposite!
:cheers: [/quote]
Oh! I gotcha. Cheers, friend!

[dbarton02]

I’m sorry… what was the question again?