I won’t disagree with you, but I wouldn’t pass up Czech brews; also very good. And there are some surprisingly good lagers coming out of Estonia these days. Try a Satu if you can find one. I’m particularly partial to the dark version.
[quote=“Pietro”]Lagers are all about subtlety and fermentation character. Honestly one of my favorite craft lagers is Brooklyn Lager (I believe its technically a pre-prohibition american pilsner). Everything really understated, but a snappy, well-fermented beer that you can drink pint after pint. Also, Victory Prima Pils. Probably the closest thing you can get to an authentic german pils made outside of germany that I have had, and I am really not a fan of their beers in general. You should definitely be able to get both @ Total Wine (jealous btw, great store). As Ken said though, definitely spend some time in the German lager section. Bonus if you can find one in cans, as it won’t have that oxidized skunky character that so many get. Warsteiner definitely comes in cans, as well as one that starts with an “R”, is in white pint cans with gold lettering that I just had and was awesome. Spaten lager or Spaten Marzen as well… Mmmmm…
Before I started brewing, I drank good spirits or Miller Lite when I went out. Then I became an alehead after my first extract brew. If it didn’t have enough resiny hops that slapped you in the face, with malts, esters, phenols etc all noticeable, it was not a good beer. Then I developed a taste for subtle, well-made beers. The bready malt and Saaz hops in a DRAUGHT Pilsner Urquell (again, bottles get skunkified): something for the highlight reel of life. Then I started on the long, never-ending spiral of sour beers from which I’m afraid I will never emerge.
Lagers have nothing to hide behind. It had better have fresh ingredients, great fermentation, and proper serving conditions, or it will not taste good. But when it is all of those things…mmmmmmmmmmm…If a brewer makes a pale ale and it has a bit too many esters, was fermented a little warm, or with not enough yeast, yes it might have some weird phenolics, but its ok, because its an ale. I bet after you snort back a few good lagers out of your favorite glass, as someone who brews beer, will be able to appreciate how frigging hard it is to make something with that much subtle goodness and clean flavors.
One other question: the brands you mentioned you had: serving makes a huge difference, ie did you have them directly out of a bottle, or in good glassware? The bar may have had dirty lines. Or taps. Or maybe it was served to you in one of those confounded shaker pint glasses. Also, please tell me you aren’t judging Negro Modelo by one that was served to you with a lime wedge.
Also, do yourself a favor, and pick up a single (or sixer) of schwartzbier. Kostrizer or Einbecker. You will thank me.
EDIT: I just reread Chris’ post and see that he’s really not into subtle flavor profiles in beers…yet :mrgreen: …in that case I might check out more of the melanoidin-rich lager styles, like dunkels, bocks (NOT shiner), and gasp viennas. Also, I believe you can get Great Lakes in Virginia…Great Lakes Dortmunder. Yes. Please.[/quote] I would have to disagree with the dortmunder statement I just can’t stand this beer tried it about 20 times now and I’m drinking it while I post. Just not a fan… I have one more left out of this mixed 12 pack can’t wait
[quote]Lagers I’ve tried off the top of my head…
- Sam Adams Boston Lager
- Dos Equis
- Negra Modelo
- Corona
- Fosters
- Heineken
- Kona Longboard
- Yuengling
- Victory Prima Pils
- PBR[/quote]
Of these, Sam Adams, Yuengling, and Victory Prima Pils are the only worth paying attention to if you are looking at exploring lagers. And even then, Sam Adams, to me, has that “Tettnang” applied to American malt taste. Too acrid and bitter…that said, it’s still a good beer and many hands above typical American lagers. Just not what a lager can be. I live near Yuengling and even closer to Victory (I probably brew with their downstream water off the Brandywine River). Yuengling has good college memories, but it’s not representative, to me, of a good German lager…to distinctively Pottsville tasting. Victory Prima Pils is, to me, very hopp. Victory Lager (more of a Helles style) is milder.
If you can ever make it, take a trip to Germany and visit Munich, Aying (to me Ayinger is one of the top 5 breweries on the planet), Bamberg (hell, anywhere in Bavaria), and head east into the Czech Republic. If you love beer, it’s worth saving up and going. I can’t emphasize that enough. 
If nothing else, try brewing a lager by the book, from one of Jamil’s recipes in Brewing Classic Styles. Make sure you have a good yeast starter, ferment between 48-52F with a good Lager yeast, and lager it cold for a month or so. It’s really not hard to make something more interesting and flavorful than most of what’s on your list on the first try or two. Try making a Dunkel, you can get away with a bit of sloppiness (higher temps, less mash accuracy, etc) and still get a good sense of what it’s about. I brew makeshift Dunkel’s in the summer using Alt yeast, then lager them for a month or so and they come out FAR FAR FAR better (richer, maltier) than crap like Ziegenbock (ok, that doesn’t say much…recent experience). In the US, Alaska’s Amber Lager (it’s supposedly an Alt recipe) and Shiner Bock, to me, are better examples of German-style beers. And use German malts…I use all Weyermann, and only German hops.
Unfortunately you won’t get a good representation from most of what you find in the U.S. Mahr’s, Ayinger, as other folks mentioned Kostrizer (Schwarzbier), Ur-Krostitzer (Sachsen East German Pils), Spital in Regensberg to name a few good ones. You can get Ayinger and Kostrizter in the U.S.
[quote=“bbrew”][quote]Lagers I’ve tried off the top of my head…
- Sam Adams Boston Lager
- Dos Equis
- Negra Modelo
- Corona
- Fosters
- Heineken
- Kona Longboard
- Yuengling
- Victory Prima Pils
- PBR[/quote]
Of these, Sam Adams, Yuengling, and Victory Prima Pils are the only worth paying attention to if you are looking at exploring lagers. [/quote]
It’s not in the same league with the German dunkels, but I think Negra Modelo is a nice dunkel that I enjoy quite a bit. I’ll take PBR over Yuengling any day, as well. But your opinion is just as valid as mine, which is why I encourage the OP (and everyone else, for that matter) to keep trying new brews.
Not to quibble (but I will anyway), Negra Modelo is a Vienna Lager.
Have you had a chance to try a good DoppleBock? If you like strong flavor, these are to die for. Good examples include: Ayinger Celebrator, Weltenburger Kloster Asam Bock, Paulaner Salvator and Samuel Adams Double Bock. I’m betting these will completely change your mind on lagers…
