Happy new year all. I have a question for the group.
I need a few more fermentors as I have been brewing quite a few “larger” beers that require more secondary time.
What I specifically need are more secondaries so I can use the primaries that are currently full.
The question??? Why bother with the smaller 5 gallon secondaries as all they can be used for is secondarying (not sure that is a real word there). Is there any reason I shouldnt buy all 6 gal primaries and use them for secondaries should I need them as such? The only reason I can come up with is if there is some problem with the larger headspace in a secondary. I need to go buy this soon so shoot this down if I am missing something.
If you’re going to be aging for a really long time, the reduced headspace limits the opportunity for oxidation. Honestly though, it probably doesn’t matter much for most beers. I’m of the belief that a typical beer releases enough CO2 during and after transfer that it purges the head space on its own pretty well.
Yes you don’t want oxygen building up in the headspace of your secondary. Once CO2 production is done, you really want that carboy full to the neck to limit O2 exposure. Air will eventually leak into the carboy through the cork and/or the airlock.
Nate beat me to it and I agree that the dissolved CO2 in beer will bleed out with time and provide some protection for a period after active ferm is done.
So the vote is. There is a basis for concern but as the beer is still offgassing quite a bit of CO2 that should provide a good blanket and thus the 6 gallons would work fine as secondaries (especially if NOT used for some super long storage like for a barley wine or RIS).
Usually happens . Thats OK though. I just listen to all the stuff and then listen to who makes sense. There are a number of folks on this forum who qualify as “opinions I will gladly listen to”. Further as usual I am thankful for the input.
So, if a person had a tank of CO2 around, and you were concerned about O2 in the head space of the secondary, couldn’t you give it a quick purge with a light blast of CO2, then install your airlock?
Yup. I have personally never bothered with it, but I have heard of people doing exactly that. Really though, if you have a kegging system, you may as well secondary in a keg. A used corny costs about the same as a carboy.
Yup. I have personally never bothered with it, but I have heard of people doing exactly that. Really though, if you have a kegging system, you may as well secondary in a keg. A used corny costs about the same as a carboy.[/quote]
And has zero chance of light skunking the beer. And zero chance of O2 getting in. Unless you have a bad seal.
I suppose so, although the idea of a “blanket of CO2” is really not happening. Yes CO2 is heavier than air, but gases mix quickly so the minute there isn’t a net movement of CO2 out of the beer, it will start mixing with air coming in. Does it matter? Depends on your palate, the beer and a lot of other stuff. If you can’t afford both fermentors and secondaries, then by all means get the 6gal fermentors. Or better yet ferment in cheap buckets and secondary in the carboys or cornies.
There’s been lots of arguments over the “blanket of CO2” theory, which I have no desire to get into, but in this case it doesn’t matter, because you have an air lock on your side. The airlock prevents more air from coming in, and so long as the beer outgasses CO2 for long enough, it WILL eventually purge all (well most) of the oxygen from the headspace. Yeah, sooner or later you have to remove the airlock, which will allow more oxygen to mix in, but the short term exposure during final transfer isn’t nearly as much concern as the long term exposure during aging. I really can’t imagine that it makes much difference at all for any reasonable aging time.
But you should still age in a corny and get the best of all worlds.
I have a similar but different question regarding carboy size:
I have two 5 gallon glass carboys. If I brew a 5 gallon batch and fill my primary up to within a few inches of the neck and use a blow off tube for the first few days, am I risking losing too much beer? Is it worth throwing down the $40-$50 for a 6.5 gallon carboy to use as a primary? Then I can use the 5 gallon carboys as secondaries. I would like to use the equipment that I currently have but do not want to brew a 5 gallon batch, fill 4.75 gallons in the carboy and then end up with 4.5 gallons after blow off.
Also, if I use the 5 gallon carboy & blow off tube, do I risk losing a significant amount of yeast thus slowing fermentation?
I have never brewed before so maybe this seems like a silly question to some. I just want to cross my T’s & dot my I’s.
Yes it is worth it, you’ll lose a gallon of beer with a 5gal carboy for a fermentor. Or you can brew in a bucket for 1/3 the cost and transfer to secondary just before ferm is done.
[quote=“Nate42”]There’s been lots of arguments over the “blanket of CO2” theory, which I have no desire to get into, but in this case it doesn’t matter, because you have an air lock on your side. The airlock prevents more air from coming in, and so long as the beer outgasses CO2 for long enough, it WILL eventually purge all (well most) of the oxygen from the headspace. Yeah, sooner or later you have to remove the airlock, which will allow more oxygen to mix in, but the short term exposure during final transfer isn’t nearly as much concern as the long term exposure during aging. I really can’t imagine that it makes much difference at all for any reasonable aging time.
But you should still age in a corny and get the best of all worlds. [/quote]
Water lets gases in, and more than likely the seal of a plastic bung pushed into the top do a carboy isn’t air tight either.
[quote=“GeerBoggles”]I have a similar but different question regarding carboy size:
I have two 5 gallon glass carboys. If I brew a 5 gallon batch and fill my primary up to within a few inches of the neck and use a blow off tube for the first few days, am I risking losing too much beer? Is it worth throwing down the $40-$50 for a 6.5 gallon carboy to use as a primary? Then I can use the 5 gallon carboys as secondaries. I would like to use the equipment that I currently have but do not want to brew a 5 gallon batch, fill 4.75 gallons in the carboy and then end up with 4.5 gallons after blow off.
Also, if I use the 5 gallon carboy & blow off tube, do I risk losing a significant amount of yeast thus slowing fermentation?
I have never brewed before so maybe this seems like a silly question to some. I just want to cross my T’s & dot my I’s.[/quote]
Buckets are cheaper and offer enough size to do full 5 gallon batched, but you do still need a plan to handle blow offs
[quote=“tom sawyer”]Yes it is worth it, you’ll lose a gallon of beer with a 5gal carboy for a fermentor. Or you can brew in a bucket for 1/3 the cost and transfer to secondary just before ferm is done.
Water lets gases in, and more than likely the seal of a plastic bung pushed into the top do a carboy isn’t air tight either.[/quote]
True of course, but on my list of things that are too small to matter much. As someone who works with hermetically sealed optoelectronics for a living, I can tell you NOTHING is really airtight, its all a matter of degree. When you have a barrier, you have to have a pressure differential to get flow across that barrier, and your fermenter will usually have some small positive pressure relative to the outside environment. Of course this isn’t always true, especially if you have a large enough temp change to have suck back happen in your airlock. If you’re gonna age for a REALLY long time, it probably wouldn’t be a bad idea to eventually replace your airlock with a solid stopper, which still wouldn’t be perfect but would be better. Yet another problem solved by cornies.
[quote=“GeerBoggles”]I have a similar but different question regarding carboy size:
I have two 5 gallon glass carboys. If I brew a 5 gallon batch and fill my primary up to within a few inches of the neck and use a blow off tube for the first few days, am I risking losing too much beer? Is it worth throwing down the $40-$50 for a 6.5 gallon carboy to use as a primary? Then I can use the 5 gallon carboys as secondaries. I would like to use the equipment that I currently have but do not want to brew a 5 gallon batch, fill 4.75 gallons in the carboy and then end up with 4.5 gallons after blow off.
Also, if I use the 5 gallon carboy & blow off tube, do I risk losing a significant amount of yeast thus slowing fermentation?
I have never brewed before so maybe this seems like a silly question to some. I just want to cross my T’s & dot my I’s.[/quote]
Sounds like more trouble than its worth. Even with 6 gallon carboys I get blowoff frequently with vigorous fermentations. Get yourself some buckets, which are cheap and all you need for most batches, and transfer to carboys when you’re going to do extended aging.
For my sours, which I intend on leaving alone for at least 24 months, I try to have the carboy filled up. I bought a handful of 6 gallon better bottles a while back on a 2 for 1 promotion, and I can use them to primary or secondary my beer, and to secondary my wine. If I were replacing my whole brewing setup, I’d probably have all 6 gallon carboys so I never have to worry about planning in order to have the right carboy handy.
I kind of have the same question; if I can get a 5 gallon carboy used for really cheap used, is it worth it since as Vulkin says, it’s really only good for a secondary (or for splitting a batch to try different yeasts maybe?)
In the absence of the great deal on the used 5 gallon carboy, I’d think spending the added few dollars to go to 6 gallon would be a better call.
That was my final conclusion. I have been sticking to 6 (or are they 6.5) gal primaries and using them for secondaries (when I do secondary). Until I go to something like the Curtek barrels this will be my choice.
. Thats OK though. I just listen to all the stuff and then listen to who makes sense. There are a number of folks on this forum who qualify as “opinions I will gladly listen to”. Further as usual I am thankful for the input.
