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Helles Water

I had posted before that I planned to brew a Helles using a water profile from this site:http://www.braukaiser.com/wiki/index.php?title=Various_water_recipes
I am doing a BIABag and will be using 7.7 Gal. of water. That works out to .3 grams per gallon or 2.31 grams each of epsom salts and CaCl. I do not yet have a decent scale so I had my pharmacist weigh out 2.3 grams of each. Well it is not but about 1/2 tsp. of each. Can this be right??!

[quote=“1tun”]I had posted before that I planned to brew a Helles using a water profile from this site:http://www.braukaiser.com/wiki/index.php?title=Various_water_recipes
I am doing a BIABag and will be using 7.7 Gal. of water. That works out to .3 grams per gallon or 2.31 grams each of epsom salts and CaCl. I do not yet have a decent scale so I had my pharmacist weigh out 2.3 grams of each. Well it is not but about 1/2 tsp. of each. Can this be right??![/quote]

Do not put Epsom salt in a Helles. Magnesium is not needed and the impact of sulphate is undesirable here IMO.

Bryan
What WOULD you put in. I am starting with distilled water. I am 62 years old and would rather not try to learn to use Brunwater. Thanks

[quote=“1tun”]Bryan
What WOULD you put in. I am starting with distilled water. I am 62 years old and would rather not try to learn to use Brunwater. Thanks[/quote]

:lol: Well I’m 63 if that makes you feel any younger.

Just use the Calcium Chloride. Add enough to get the Ca+ up to 60-75ppm and be done with it. Helles is a delicate brew, the Ca+ for the mash enzymes & pH and the Cl- for flavor & body is all you need. :cheers:

[quote=“BryanH”][quote=“1tun”]I had posted before that I planned to brew a Helles using a water profile from this site:http://www.braukaiser.com/wiki/index.php?title=Various_water_recipes
I am doing a BIABag and will be using 7.7 Gal. of water. That works out to .3 grams per gallon or 2.31 grams each of epsom salts and CaCl. I do not yet have a decent scale so I had my pharmacist weigh out 2.3 grams of each. Well it is not but about 1/2 tsp. of each. Can this be right??![/quote]

Do not put Epsom salt in a Helles. Magnesium is not needed and the impact of sulphate is undesirable here IMO.[/quote]

THIS, for sure.

[quote=“1tun”]Bryan
What WOULD you put in. I am starting with distilled water. I am 62 years old and would rather not try to learn to use Brunwater. Thanks[/quote]

I’m 62 also and learning Brunwater improved my beer considerably. Do it.

Bru N Water is easy.
I really enjoy showing newer brewers I know this application as it removes a lot of guesswork when it comes to water, sparge ph, mash ph etc…
Also it temporarily removes the need to purchase PH pens/ strips until the brewer feels the need.

All it takes is entering your current water report on the water input tab.

Manipulate sparge water if needed.

Enter a grist on the mash tab.

Then moving in most cases the gypsum, calcium chloride, and in some cases lime numbers on the water adjustment tab on water/sparge/ mash/ boil addition. Then using an acid in these stages to move the PH around if necessary.

I regularly hit the stated PH when checking with my PH pen. In some cases I have seen a lean +/- 0.10 between my bru n water calcs and the true PH measured on brew day.

Bru n Water helps newer brewers understand how the minerals and acids relate and then can go out and buy a PH pen if they feel the need to double check now. In the past you had to consider using enough acid malt, acid additions or guess the super light or extremely dark grain bills and always adjust PH on the fly. With these spreadsheets you have more than a certainty of what is going on with each and every water source, grain bill etc… Plus you now have a better view of potential boost to calcium in the mash, boil etc… Where in the past all these numbers were a guess at best for home brewers.

Give it a go.

If not then do not add magnesium to any beer. It is not needed in any way and will definitely impact flavor profile and in some cases cause diarrhea if added in too much concentration.
If you have a water report or idea if you your using distilled etc… this would help us give you better targets if your not considering using the application.

Well OK guys. Iv’e never seen a spreadsheet in my life so you can see how daunting this is going to be for me but I will download the thing and see if I can figure it out. I may need some help though. Thanks

+1 to all of the above. If you have a local brew store or home brew club, check and see if someone uses Bru’n water - I bet they would help you with it. It looks more intimidating than it actually is.

One thing you need to know is what water you are starting with. If you are using your own water for some or all of the water, you really need a report on minerals from Ward lab or other resource. If you are using Reverse Osmosis water… you are good to go, as it has basically nothing in it except what you add.

Once you know what you are starting with, it is not real hard to formulate 4-6 basic water profiles that will get you where you want to go (like the example above with the Helles). Once you get a basic profile for each core beer area (Light Lager, Hoppy Light Lager, IPA/Bitter, Amber Balanced or Hoppy, Dark (porters, stouts) etc.) you can go back to that same basic profile again and again.

Here is a link to some examples of a few profiles for some different styles - these start with the idea that you are basically using R.O. water, or something with very little mineral content in it.

http://www.homebrewtalk.com/f128/brewin ... er-198460/

Epsom salt tastes terrible. You can use whatever calculator or recipe you want to figure out salts, but when the calculator is all done chugging, then take whatever it calculated for Epsom salt, and throw that part out the window. Your beer will turn out much better without any Epsom.

:cheers:

[quote=“dmtaylo2”]Epsom salt tastes terrible. You can use whatever calculator or recipe you want to figure out salts, but when the calculator is all done chugging, then take whatever it calculated for Epsom salt, and throw that part out the window. Your beer will turn out much better without any Epsom.

:cheers: [/quote]

I mostly agree with Dave. The magnesium in epsom has little use in brewing. It especially has no place in brewing a Helles. But there are beers in which Mg has a helpful contribution with its bitterness and sourness…bitter and hoppy beers. Just recognize that the Mg content should typically never exceed 40 ppm.

[quote=“mabrungard”]

I mostly agree with Dave. The magnesium in epsom has little use in brewing. It especially has no place in brewing a Helles. But there are beers in which Mg has a helpful contribution with its bitterness and sourness…bitter and hoppy beers. Just recognize that the Mg content should typically never exceed 40 ppm.[/quote]

And I agree with that. Even with no addition of Mg most water has at least a trace amount and the malt itself probably has enough to make the beer happy. I do add small amounts of Epsom salt to most of my IPAs and Dortmunder which are my exceptions to the rule. Your 40ppm ceiling is a good number.

[quote=“mabrungard”][quote=“dmtaylo2”]Epsom salt tastes terrible. You can use whatever calculator or recipe you want to figure out salts, but when the calculator is all done chugging, then take whatever it calculated for Epsom salt, and throw that part out the window. Your beer will turn out much better without any Epsom.

:cheers: [/quote]

I mostly agree with Dave. The magnesium in epsom has little use in brewing. It especially has no place in brewing a Helles. But there are beers in which Mg has a helpful contribution with its bitterness and sourness…bitter and hoppy beers. Just recognize that the Mg content should typically never exceed 40 ppm.[/quote]

I don’t have my reports in front of me, but starting with RO water, it seems that Bru’n Water tells me to add Epsom salt to nearly every profile. I do not know how much this might contribute to off flavors, but what is the alternative?

+1. A tiny bit of magnesium is okay. Anything more than a tiny bit is bad. 40 ppm sounds right.

560, I really do think that Epsom was ruining some of your good beers. Throw it out.

[quote=“Denny”][quote=“1tun”]Bryan
What WOULD you put in. I am starting with distilled water. I am 62 years old and would rather not try to learn to use Brunwater. Thanks[/quote]

I’m 62 also and learning Brunwater improved my beer considerably. Do it.[/quote]

:lol: Well I’m 63 if that makes you feel any younger. "

What is this a meeting of the old farts club?

If it is sign me up, I’m 63. :cheers:

Then something is wrong. It is a rare case in which you would want to or need to add Epsom Salt (MgSO4) to a beer. The styles I mentioned above, IPA and Dortmunder, are the only ones that come to mind where increased levels of Mg+ may be desired. Only trace amounts of Mg+ ion are necessary, as in single digit ppm, and between trace amounts found in much water as well as in the malt itself that small quantity is usually covered. If you want to increase sulphates Gypsum (Calcium Sulphate/CaSO4) is almost always a better choice. If that program is suggesting Epsom salt for most beers then either it or your interpretation of it is incorrect.

I do brew a lot of IPA’s, but I will have to go back and look at the other styles.

OK I downloaded the dam Bruinwater file. I should say I have a ward labs water report. My water is harder than an immoral woman’s heart.
Sodium Na 63
Potassium K 2
Calcium Ca 71
Magnesium Mg 21
Total Hardness CaCO3 265
Sulfate SO4-S 15
Chloride Cl 71
Carbonate CO3 <1
Bicarbonate HCO3 255
Total Alkalinity CaCO3 not detected
So I am still needing to brew that Helles. The grain is crushed. I am doing Brew in a bag. 7.7 gallons of DISTILLED water. Do I just leave the water profile on the spread sheet blank? I wish someone would post something like " Just put in X tsp. of something and be done with it" Can you tell I am getting cranky in my old age?
Thanks

About a teaspoon of calcium chloride in the mash water, a teaspoon in the kettle before you boil…be done with it.

What is i took 10 gallons of distilled water added 2 tsp calcium chloride…would that make good water for a helles?

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