This might be a silly question, but is it possible to brew a Dunkel not using a lagering yeast? low temperatures for that type of yeast (wyeast 2308) would be difficult.
Or is not using a lager yeast not going to make me a Dunkel? 
Cheers,
It wonāt be a true dunkel but if you use something like wyeast 1007 at cooler temps, say 58Ā°- 60Ā° youāll get very close.
Iāve done this with my Oāfest recipe with 1007 in that temp range. It made a really nice ale that got cleaner and better the longer it was on tap, basically lageringā¦Anyway yea do it. Youāll make a good beer.
Iāve not done a lager, and Iāve made a dunkelā¦ A friend is dunkel crazy, it turned out great! I use wyeast belgium strong mixed with dennyās favā¦ Actually a very good combo for cream ales too!! While on the dunkel subject, anyone see or hear about caramelizing in the brew pot? Sneezles61 :roll:
Have you ever had a real dunkel, like Ayinger, to compare?
BTW, you canāt get temps high enough to caramelize wort in a kettle of liquid.
Itās just a guess, but Iād think you could make a pretty decent dunkel with lager yeast at 58-60. Thereās enough going on in a lager that some esters might not be an issue, especially if you cold conditioned in the bottle. A dirty lager might still be more lager-like than a similar wort fermented with a clean ale yeast.
Not in my experience. There are some very clean lager like ale yeasts, specifically WY1056 and WY1007. The key is to ferment them as cold as you can get (55-58F) and use a long period of cold conditioning after fermentation.
I brewed an Oktoberfest last year with the 1007 yeast at low 60ās temp, turned out great. Not the authentic Oktoberfest experience, but it produced a great beer and no one could tell the difference.
OP, also try Saflager 34/70 (wy2124) at ale temps. It creates a clean beer.
Or, you could brew an alt bier 
To me, Uerige Altstadt is basically a dunkel with a clean German ale yeast.
[quote=āBeerskā]OP, also try Saflager 34/70 (wy2124) at ale temps. It creates a clean beer.
Or, you could brew an alt bier To me, Uerige Altstadt is basically a dunkel with a clean German ale yeast.[/quote]
I used 34/70 for a series of lagers this past winter. One was a dunkel. I fermented 52-54F primary, and Iām really happy with how it turned out. No direct experience with ale temps, but Beersk knows his lagersā¦
Hey Denny, no not tried an Ayinger yet, Iāve tried ā¦ warensteiner[ canāt even pronounce it let alone spell it] which was on tap and thoroughly enjoyed itā¦ hard to find up here. As far as caramelizing, just some stuff I read to do that with a quart or bit more then bring up to boil volumeā¦ I will search for more examples, which are? Sneezles61 :cheers:
[quote=āporkchopā][quote=āBeerskā]OP, also try Saflager 34/70 (wy2124) at ale temps. It creates a clean beer.
Or, you could brew an alt bier To me, Uerige Altstadt is basically a dunkel with a clean German ale yeast.[/quote]
I used 34/70 for a series of lagers this past winter. One was a dunkel. I fermented 52-54F primary, and Iām really happy with how it turned out. No direct experience with ale temps, but Beersk knows his lagersā¦[/quote]
Thanks, man. They could always be better of course!
But 34/70 is as good of a lager yeast as any and itās crazy versatile.
I donāt think you want to make a sweet dunkel, which is what caramelizing will give you. A dunkel should be malty but dry, not sweet.
How long to cold condition in the bottle?
Iām assuming you ferment for 2-3 weeks at 55-60 and then bottle and put the bottles in the fridge instead of room temp.
I donāt think you want to make a sweet dunkel, which is what caramelizing will give you. A dunkel should be malty but dry, not sweet.[/quote]
The Ayinger dunkel tends to be a little sweet for me. Maybe Iām not getting fresh bottles, but I canāt drink much more than a bottle of it.
Wow, thatās interesting. I donāt find it sweet at all. Difference in taste perception, I guess.
Wow, thatās interesting. I donāt find it sweet at all. Difference in taste perception, I guess.[/quote]Hmm, that may be. I would like to try it on tap somewhere. I had the Ayinger Oktoberfest on tap last fall, definitely not something I can drink liter after liter ofā¦just too sweet and rich.
[quote=āCameronBrewsā]How long to cold condition in the bottle?
Iām assuming you ferment for 2-3 weeks at 55-60 and then bottle and put the bottles in the fridge instead of room temp.[/quote]
Thatās not how I would do a mock lager. Iāve leave it in the primary at least 3-4 weeks at the coldest temp that the yeast is active at (just below 60 for 1056 or US-05), then bottle and condition for a few weeks at around 70. They wonāt carb if you immediately put them in the fridge. After theāre carbed, Iād stick them in the fridge for as long as you can leave them before drinking. Lagering works just as well on carbed beer as on uncarbed.
I will do a dunkel round up and see where it leads my taste budsā¦. good threads here!! Sneezles61 :cheers:
Me too, although the Medusa Limited Edition is going to come first, since I just ordered that kit. :shock:
