Here’s a post from Anchor’s blog where they talk about their open fermenters. Check out the last photo.
https://www.anchorbrewing.com/blog/brew ... mentation/[quote=“bunderbunder”]Here’s a post from Anchor’s blog where they talk about their open fermenters. Check out the last photo.
https://www.anchorbrewing.com/blog/brew ... mentation/[/quote]Thanks for the link.That’s an interesting page, but I don’t know where they get off saying that they’re the only American brewery that still uses open fermenters on a production scale. That’s absolutely not true. Sierra Nevada does it, too ( at least for their Kellerweisse) , and so do quite a few other breweries, although most of them are much smaller. In fact, I used to work at a brewery that does open fermentation.
I’m guessing “on a production scale” is a very special phrase in their book. :blah:
If you want to use a different food safe fermenter check this out:
http://www.kegworks.com/polycarbonate-f ... 37-p176046[quote=“Loopie Beer”]If you want to use a different food safe fermenter check this out:
http://www.kegworks.com/polycarbonate-f ... 37-p176046[/quote]That’s exactly the kind of container I’ve been working with for years in the foodservice world. The only problem with that vessel is that it’s not wide and shallow, which are the attributes I was looking for in my current fermentation vessel.
Stainless catering dishes from a restaurant supply site may be an alternative. Not sure about lid options for them though.
We don’t need no stinkin’ lids!
http://s129.photobucket.com/user/stealthcruiser72/media/IMG_0090_zpsc58615ea.jpg.html
That’s so stinking pretty. I’ll bet it smells amazing in that room. I would never leave, ever.
It was amazing!
It was at “Kielerbrau” brewery, in Kiel, Germany.
[quote=“Stealthcruiser”]It was amazing!
It was at “Kielerbrau” brewery, in Kiel, Germany.[/quote]
The closest I’ve come to open fermentation like that was using one of my kettles as a fermenter. I pussed out and used the lid (kid/pets/etc), but it was still awesome to open the lid and see the frothy goodness at high krausen.
I’ve messed with a few different things, but buckets and Speidel 60L plastic barrel fermenters are my choice . I can see trying a sour with open fermentation, though, or using lightly covered lids or prices of foil to cover a cool ship type approach. It makes some sense that flavor would be affected by radical shape differences, as might fermentation time?
I’m skeptical. I’m not sure it is an issue at home-brew sizes. Some of these effects come from the pressure of many feet of liquid. A foot of water will create a pressure of ~ .45 PSI. So I can see how yeast might respond differently with 10 feet of wort over them creating ~ 4.5 PSI, versus 20 feet exerting a pressure of ~ 9 PSI. But these differences are very, very small at home-brew scale.
IOW, I don’t think geometry is the issue, it is depth.
-kenc
[quote=“deliusism1”][quote=“S.Scoggin”] …
I have to ask. Why no spacing after punctuation?[/quote]
I don’t know.I guess I just get used to posting on YouTube, where characters are limited. Does it really bother you that much?[/quote]
FWIW (not anything really), it bothers me. It makes it harder to read when sentences are scrunched together.
And while I’m in this mode, might I suggest more descriptive titles to threads? “Check This Out” is generic, could be anything. Why not something specific, like “Experimenting with Fermentor Geometries”?
:cheers:
-kenc
[quote=“kenc_zymurgy”][quote=“deliusism1”][quote=“S.Scoggin”] …
I have to ask. Why no spacing after punctuation?[/quote]
I don’t know.I guess I just get used to posting on YouTube, where characters are limited. Does it really bother you that much?[/quote]
FWIW (not anything really), it bothers me. It makes it harder to read when sentences are scrunched together.
And while I’m in this mode, might I suggest more descriptive titles to threads? “Check This Out” is generic, could be anything. Why not something specific, like “Experimenting with Fermentor Geometries”?
:cheers:
-kenc[/quote]
I picked that heading just to get peoples’ attention, I guess. I find that a lot of the same old issues are discussed here (sparging techniques, attenuation problems, recipe tweaking, etc.) over and over again, and I thought people might be more willing to read something if they thought it was really something that doesn’t get discussed here very often, which I think this kind of is.
I’m skeptical. I’m not sure it is an issue at home-brew sizes. Some of these effects come from the pressure of many feet of liquid. A foot of water will create a pressure of ~ .45 PSI. So I can see how yeast might respond differently with 10 feet of wort over them creating ~ 4.5 PSI, versus 20 feet exerting a pressure of ~ 9 PSI. But these differences are very, very small at home-brew scale.
IOW, I don’t think geometry is the issue, it is depth.
-kenc[/quote]
By radical, I mean to include depth and surface area to depth ratio, because if more yeast is open to a greater surface area, the oxygen use is likely enhanced, I would think (more cells exposed to the surface of the fermenting wort). So time wise, I would think that it might speed up the process, all other things being equal (oxygenation, pitch rate, temperature and OG). Speeding up the process alone could affect flavor, but so could the vessel shape in terms of changing the dynamics of the fermentation ever so slightly. I could be wrong, but I don’t see it as merely a pressure issue.
[quote=“ynotbrusum”][quote=“kenc_zymurgy”] …
IOW, I don’t think geometry is the issue, it is depth.
-kenc[/quote]
By radical, I mean to include depth and surface area to depth ratio, because if more yeast is open to a greater surface area, the oxygen use is likely enhanced, I would think (more cells exposed to the surface of the fermenting wort). So time wise, I would think that it might speed up the process, all other things being equal (oxygenation, pitch rate, temperature and OG). Speeding up the process alone could affect flavor, but so could the vessel shape in terms of changing the dynamics of the fermentation ever so slightly. I could be wrong, but I don’t see it as merely a pressure issue.[/quote]
I might be wrong too, I’m just speculating. Perhaps the surface area is a factor that could make geometry important. But I’m thinking most of the O2 the yeast use is dissolved in the wort. All the discussions on aerating wort center on the dissolved O2 in the wort. I’ve never heard much regarding the amount of O2 in the head space.
I always forget how to do these calcs (moles?), but how does the typical 8ppm O2 in wort compare to the ~ 18% O2 in the air in the head space? If this is a factor, one could stick with their current bucket and inject a measured amount of O2 in the head space to equalize this to a larger surface area.
-kenc
-kenc
I’m skeptical. I’m not sure it is an issue at home-brew sizes. Some of these effects come from the pressure of many feet of liquid. A foot of water will create a pressure of ~ .45 PSI. So I can see how yeast might respond differently with 10 feet of wort over them creating ~ 4.5 PSI, versus 20 feet exerting a pressure of ~ 9 PSI. But these differences are very, very small at home-brew scale.
IOW, I don’t think geometry is the issue, it is depth.
-kenc[/quote]
By radical, I mean to include depth and surface area to depth ratio, because if more yeast is open to a greater surface area, the oxygen use is likely enhanced, I would think (more cells exposed to the surface of the fermenting wort). So time wise, I would think that it might speed up the process, all other things being equal (oxygenation, pitch rate, temperature and OG). Speeding up the process alone could affect flavor, but so could the vessel shape in terms of changing the dynamics of the fermentation ever so slightly. I could be wrong, but I don’t see it as merely a pressure issue.[/quote]
It certainly sped up the fermentation process for me! The first time I used this thing, my beer was completely done, or at least appeared to be, in about 3 days, and that was without using a yeast starter! That’s the fastest fermentation I’ve ever had without using a starter. BUT…the actual level of attenuation reached was only about 69%, and I was using a yeast strain that should have finished at least in the mid 70s range. So I’m not entirely sure what this says about the shape of the fermenter. I had a bit of apprehension about the yeast dropping out of suspension too quickly due to the shallowness of the fermenter, so this doesn’t really surprise me, but it is also winter, and I’ve been having issues with beers not fully fermenting for a couple of months now, presumable due to the lower ambient air temperature. I don’t know. I guess I just need to keep experimenting with this fermenter for a while to see how it behaves with a variety of different yeasts.
