Brew In A Bag Question

What I’ve done/do is not BIAB and BIAB and MIAB is certainly not the same. IMO, even MIAB is a misnomer. the mash is done in a round cooler = mashtun. the only difference between the round tun and retangular tun is I omit the the braid or manifold and substitute a nylon bag. I orginally had the braid, but changed because using the nylon bag makes clean-up much easier. ( I think if large nylon bag were available for retangular coolers, many would drop the braid in a heartbeat…but I digress.) The mash is the same as any AG mash: measure grain, determine the amount of strike water that is necessary, heat accordingly, add strike water to tun, add grain, mash, vorlauf, drain, determine the amount of sparge water that is necessary, heat accordingly, sparge, vorlauf, drain, boil.

BIAB is clearly differrent: there is no sparge in BIAB. strike and sparge water are combined at the beginning, grain is added (in a large bag), temp is quickly brought to mash temp, temp is maintained for mash period by adjusting the flame, bag is removed, wort is boiled. No sparge, no vorlauf, no attempting to keep pot temp constant (which in my mind is almost impossible give a heat source at the bottom and constant heat loss thru top and sides of SS pot.)

Both methods produce beer and that’s what’s important. Just like extract vs AG. But BIAB and what some call MIAB are not the same.

cheers.

[quote=“StormyBrew”]What I’ve done/do is not BIAB and BIAB and MIAB is certainly not the same[/quote]There is no “correct” and one way to do a MIAB, it’s simply a term used when the grain is held in a bag, whether in a cooler or a kettle (or even a bucket), and regardless of the sparge method (or lack of one) and the manifold (or lack of one). Batch-sparging with a bag in the cooler is a widely-used variant of MIAB.

I disagree. There is a correct (or at least generally accepted method) way to do a BIAB just as there is a correct way to do mash/batch-sparge or mash/fly sparge. these terms have meaning.

If one were to define MIAB and BIAB as the process of mashing in a pot, grain in a bag, with the full volume of water, no sparge, external heat required, no “mashtun”, then fine, they could be interchangeable. And I am fine with that.

But when the general process is batch-sparge, MIAB is not an appropriate term if it is interchangeable with BIAB and not appropriate for those that use a bag in their mashtun.

:cheers:

I have always used Denny’s cooler technique for AG, but BIAB has always intrigued me. I’m a big fan of anything K.I.S.S.
What’s the general rule for determining max grain bill for a kettle? I have a 34 qt kettle, which really only holds 30 qt. Obviously depends on grain absorption, desired mash volume, sparge volume, and mash thickness. Not accounting for grain volume, doing backwards math give me:

20qt sparge
10qt mash
10qt ÷ 1.25qt/lb = 8lbs of grain

Is this correct? If so this would give me 3.5-4.5 gallon batches for the range of SG that I brew in.

[quote=

BIAB is clearly differrent: there is no sparge in BIAB. strike and sparge water are combined at the beginning, grain is added (in a large bag), temp is quickly brought to mash temp, temp is maintained for mash period by adjusting the flame, bag is removed, wort is boiled. No sparge, no vorlauf, no attempting to keep pot temp constant (which in my mind is almost impossible give a heat source at the bottom and constant heat loss thru top and sides of SS pot.)

Both methods produce beer and that’s what’s important. Just like extract vs AG. But BIAB and what some call MIAB are not the same.

cheers.[/quote]

This statement couldn’t be more untrue. I BIAB or MIAB or whatever you want to call it. It’s the same thing. I Measure out strike water and sparge water separately. I do get the strike water to a specific temp and then add grain so it settles to the desired mash temp. I then put the pot in a warm oven to hold the temp constant for an hour. When the mash is done, I remove the grain sack and dunk it in a second pot that has the premeasured sparge water.

You’re doing the exact same thing. The only difference is that you are mashing in a cooler to help keep the temps constant. I put my pot in the oven to keep the temps constant.

What you are describing with adding grains and then getting to a mash temp sounds more like steeping specialty grains, which is something totally different.

[quote=“dobe12”][quote=

BIAB is clearly differrent: there is no sparge in BIAB. strike and sparge water are combined at the beginning, grain is added (in a large bag), temp is quickly brought to mash temp, temp is maintained for mash period by adjusting the flame, bag is removed, wort is boiled. No sparge, no vorlauf, no attempting to keep pot temp constant (which in my mind is almost impossible give a heat source at the bottom and constant heat loss thru top and sides of SS pot.)

Both methods produce beer and that’s what’s important. Just like extract vs AG. But BIAB and what some call MIAB are not the same.

cheers.[/quote]

[i]Dobe12 said, "this statement couldn’t be more untrue. I BIAB or MIAB or whatever you want to call it. It’s the same thing. I Measure out strike water and sparge water separately. I do get the strike water to a specific temp and then add grain so it settles to the desired mash temp. I then put the pot in a warm oven to hold the temp constant for an hour. When the mash is done, I remove the grain sack and dunk it in a second pot that has the premeasured sparge water.

You’re doing the exact same thing. The only difference is that you are mashing in a cooler to help keep the temps constant. I put my pot in the oven to keep the temps constant.

What you are describing with adding grains and then getting to a mash temp sounds more like steeping specialty grains, which is something totally different.[/quote]"[/i]

My original statement is completely true. Original BIAB is what I said: 1 pot, full volume. You’ve modified the BIAB process with two separate pots.

I do a denny cohn mash/batch sparge and it is different from both BIAB and your modified BIAB. The good news is that we both make beer.

Search this forum for BIAB and you’ll find this link on/about page 20…origins of BIAB.

http://www.aussiehomebrewer.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=11694&hl=biab

cheers.

[quote=“StormyBrew”]I disagree. There is a correct (or at least generally accepted method) way to do a BIAB just as there is a correct way to do mash/batch-sparge or mash/fly sparge. these terms have meaning.[/quote]Well, I’m going to disagree with you on this - there is no “correct” way to batch- or fly-sparge, there’s only a defining concept for each: batch-sparging drains wort at one consistent gravity and fly-sparge drains with a gradient. MIAB is just a variant of batch-sparging. You’re batch-sparging in a bag, otherwise known as BSIAB. :wink:

I thought it would be steeping grains, as that is what extractors do with their special grains, and this is pretty much the same.

But Tomato - Tomahto eh?

[quote=“CliffordBrewing”]What’s the general rule for determining max grain bill for a kettle?[/quote]There are interweb sites that will estimate the max capacity for a mashtun like this one:
http://rackers.org/calcs.shtml/

But you’re not limited to the capacity of the kettle. I taught a friend of mine how to MIAB with a 9-gal kettle and she’s making some big beers with it - she sets her efficiency to 60-65% to get the grain bill, then calculates the water she can handle in the kettle with some room for stirring, does a no-sparge routine, and then tops up the kettle to get a decent pre-boil volume. The lower efficiency accounts for the loss of the higher-gravity wort in the grain.

Great, more acronyms…I BSIAB only if there is also a BSOABH (batch sparger on a braided hose) and BSOAM (batch sparge on a manifold.) And i agree, “correct” is less accurate… but “generally accepted method” would be appropriate, no?

Regarding MIAB, is there really a difference between it and BIAB? Isn’t it just an americanized term for the aussie term BIAB? I mean, BSIAB is not MIAB. At least not for those of us that BSIAB. :wink:

Come to think of it, is there a generally accepted process called MIAB that actually differs from BIAB? I think the two are interchangeable and neither include a sparge in the process. I think if one includes a sparge in the process it is a batch-sparge process, not a BIAB process. But then, that’s just me.

:cheers:

My head hurts :x

And this thread has gotten stupid :roll:

[quote=“dobe12”]My head hurts :x

And this thread has gotten stupid :roll: [/quote]

Then allow me to cloud the issue :wink:

I Mash In A Bag In A Bucket, Then Dunk-Sparge In A Brew Kettle.

MIABIABTDSIABK. That’s real catchy :roll:

The advantage for me is the Brew Kettle doesn’t need to be as large as with a no-sparge BIAB, , since you don’t have all the grain and all the water in the same container at the same time. And I don’t need a separate Hot Liquor Tank for the sparge water, since that is heated and used right in the brew kettle (or alternately collect the wort in another container if you use the BK as the HLT).

I do split boils on the stove-top. So I use two 3.5G HDPE buckets, a bag in each (these both fit in my warmed then turned-off oven, so hold temperature well in there). Heat the sparge water in each 5G brew kettle, when the mash is complete just stir then lift the bag from the bucket, allow to drain a bit, then dunk-sparge the bag in the brew kettle (once for each bucket/kettle).

Works well for me, since I prefer to brew indoors and this makes it easy to use the stove-top for a 5.5G batch. Just two cheap 5G Alum Tamale pots for BKs.

-kenc

[quote=“kenc_zymurgy”][quote=“dobe12”]My head hurts :x

And this thread has gotten stupid :roll: [/quote]

Then allow me to cloud the issue :wink:

I Mash In A Bag In A Bucket, Then Dunk-Sparge In A Brew Kettle.

MIABIABTDSIABK. That’s real catchy :roll:

[/quote]

Well played!

:cheers:

I’m truly sorry about this, I just couldn’t help myself:

Grind with corona mill, mash in blue five gallon cooler at one and a quarter quart per pound, fly sparge without a sparge arm, lauter through copper manifold, boil in stainless steel kettle, cool with homemade immersion chiller, pitch rehydrated dry yeast, ferment in plastic bucket.

GCMMBFGCOQQPSPWSALCMBSSKCHMICPRDYFPB

:cheers: