Thinking about making a session IPA with 30 minute boil and a crap load of late hops. All grain. 1.042 OG. Why should I not do this?
Possible corny, vegetal DMS flavors. Also possible haze / lack of clarity to the finished beer. That being said…
Coincidentally, I have already decided that I’m going to experiment with a 45-minute boil on my next batch. So we’ll see what happens. My own personal guess is… boil time really doesn’t matter as much as everyone says.
Cheers! :cheers:
I did an unplanned 40 minute boil on a mild last month, after it started raining/sleeting just as I was getting to a boil. Other than some extra volume, I haven’t noticed any ill effects.
I read an analysis of why to boil a long time some years ago, and they pretty much broke down the different things that are being done in the boil. Seemed like the only really essential issues were generating hot break (takes about 10 minutes to complete), driving out DMS (time to achieve is variable based on the malt used), getting the most bitterness from the hops (about 60 minutes), and killing off any microbes (takes about 15 minutes).
If you are hop bursting at the end, you obviously are not trying to maximize bittering extraction from the hops, so DMS is the only real worry, but it may be that modern malting techniques have reduced that issue as well, and less than the standard 60 minutes typically quoted could be fine. Pilsner malt is suppose to be the worst for DMS problems, and it is often recommended that a 90 minute boil be used if you use pilsner malt for your base grain. But I know a lot of brewers are getting fine results from 60 minute boils with pilsner these days. So maybe the pale malt needs less time boiling as well.
maillard reaction is another consideration with short boils. this could impact color and flavor of beer.
maillard reaction is another consideration with short boils. this could impact color and flavor of beer
oops sorry for double post
[quote=“rebuiltcellars”]I read an analysis of why to boil a long time some years ago, and they pretty much broke down the different things that are being done in the boil. Seemed like the only really essential issues were generating hot break (takes about 10 minutes to complete), driving out DMS (time to achieve is variable based on the malt used), getting the most bitterness from the hops (about 60 minutes), and killing off any microbes (takes about 15 minutes).
If you are hop bursting at the end, you obviously are not trying to maximize bittering extraction from the hops, so DMS is the only real worry, but it may be that modern malting techniques have reduced that issue as well, and less than the standard 60 minutes typically quoted could be fine. Pilsner malt is suppose to be the worst for DMS problems, and it is often recommended that a 90 minute boil be used if you use pilsner malt for your base grain. But I know a lot of brewers are getting fine results from 60 minute boils with pilsner these days. So maybe the pale malt needs less time boiling as well.[/quote]
This is basically what I was thinking also. The other factor that came to mind was reduction in wort pH, which can be important in setting up conditions for the right finished pH post-fermentation. In my experience, finished pH is very important in an IPA. Thinking that could be worked out using a pre-boil pH adjustment.
This is an experiment I would like to do, but I think I will save it for a beer that’s not so hop-forward, so the beer can be more easily assessed for off-flavors.
I did a 60 minute boil using Castle pils a couple weeks ago, but have not been able to taste it yet to see if DMS is an issue.
This is a good point for malty beers. Not something I would be concerned about in the type of IPA I like.
Thanks for the responses, guys. If I follow through with this at some point, I’ll post the results.
Please do post your thoughts when your experiment has run its course.
Subscribed.
With a 30m boil I could get 5.5G of AG done in about 2 hours. Besides the potential time savings, this could cut fuel costs nearly 50% too (and reduce carbon footprint for the green conscious). There are few guys on another forum doing some radical time savings stuff and they have been successfully using a 30m boil with no issues.
I think the concerns have been addressed and the experienced brewer can certainly make the appropriate changes to offset these. IE IBU, color, gravity, pH. I agree with the consensus, DMS is largest potential issue but:
- Nearly all malts are modified well beyond DMS concerns nowadays. Consult the data sheet to confirm. http://morebeer.com/brewingtechniques/bmg/noonan.html
- Research indicates DMS is reduced when wort is exposed to copper during chilling. DMS is converted to insoluble copper sulfide. The radical brewers above do a no chill and 30m boil and that is just too risky to me;
- DMS is expelled during fermentation.
KC, in my experience, only beers with over 100ppm Ca had an appreciable pH drop during the boil. In my IPAs with the gypsum boost, I got .2 but on others with less Ca .1. Not sure what you’ve seen.
[quote=“zwiller”]1. Nearly all malts are modified well beyond DMS concerns nowadays. Consult the data sheet to confirm. http://morebeer.com/brewingtechniques/bmg/noonan.html;
.[/quote]Zwiller, there is an error in that link. You need to remove the semicolon and the end.
Thanks. Fixed
[quote=“dmtaylo2”]
Coincidentally, I have already decided that I’m going to experiment with a 45-minute boil on my next batch. So we’ll see what happens. My own personal guess is… boil time really doesn’t matter as much as everyone says.
Cheers! :cheers: [/quote]
I switched to 45 minute boils on my ales years ago and there was no difference in the quality that I, as an untrained taster, could detect.
