my potential Rye Wit recipe

[donosborn]

Ever since the BYO article from almost a year ago I have wanted to make a Rye beer. I am an extract brewer but can do partial mashes.

First, the recipe that I found here (and many other places):
http://brewery.org/brewery/cm3/recs/09_34.html

3 pounds, 6--row pale malt
1--1/2 pound, rye malt
1--1/2 pound, wheat malt

3 pounds, honey
2 pounds, dry malt extract

1 ounce, Hallertauer (boil)
1/2 ounce, Hallertauer (15 minute boil)
1/2 ounce, Hallertauer (2 minute boil)
1 ounce, whole cardamon
1 ounce, coriander seed
1/2 ounce, orange peel

Belgian ale yeast

O.G.: 1.050
F.G.: 1.008
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------

I have used the above recipe (mostly the grain bill) as a base, combined it with my favorite Wit recipe, and come up with this:

1.5 (or 2?) lbs Rye
1.5 lbs Wheat Malt
8 oz Belgian Aromatic


3 lbs Muntons Wheat DME
1 lbs Muntons Extra Light DME

.75 oz Willamette 4.3% AA (60 min)
.5 oz Willamette (15 min)
.25 oz Cascade (2 min)

.75 oz Belgian Bitter Orange Peel (15 min)
1 tsp crushed Coriander seeds (15 min)
.5 oz Belgian Bitter Orange Peel (2 min)
1 tsp crushed Coriander seeds (2 min)

Yeast: Wyeast 3944 Belgian Witbier.

OG: 1.052
FG: 1.010
-----------------

It wil be a little darker than a typical Wit but so be it.

My main question is does that look like an adequate grain bill to utilize the Rye (get some sugars from the mash, as well as some decent Rye flavor)?

Any other comments would be appreciated too.

thanks guys,
don

[Denny]

Don, I'll try to dig up my rye wit recipe for comparison.

[donosborn]

I dug up my BYO Rye issue and have some more info and questions.

First of all, Horst says you should always use Rye in conjunction with some Pale malt, so I figure I should add that to my grain bill. Denny, you say to take half of your Rye amt and add that much Pale. I can dig that.

Horst talks about a multi temperature, multi step mash for all grain brewing, such as:
110 deg 20 min
122 deg 20 min
149 deg 45 min
158 deg 20 min.

Denny, you just recommend a steep/mash at 152 for 45 min. Is that adequate to convert the Rye, or should I do something to approximate Horst's suggestions? I mean, I could do his first 3 steps if you thought it would be a better approach.

Also, Rye is smaller than barley malt, so do you think I will need to have the guys at NB adjust their mill to crush it? I guess I could run the Rye through and see if it gets crushed. I could ask them too.

Denny your grain bill for your Rye Wit is:
2.75 lbs pale
2.25 lbs rye
2.25 lbs flaked soft white wheat
2.75 lbs wheat

Could you attempt a conversion of that to a 4 lb partial mash? I am planning on using some malt extract (see above). Also, your Tg of 1.049 is about what I'm shooting for.

Otherwise, going with what I have above, I could just do something like:

2 lbs Rye
1 lb Pale
.5 lbs Wheat Malt
.5 lbs Belgian Aromatic


I think that is it for now. Thanks for the help. (And it was cool to see a picture of you in the front of the mag. Oregon mountains, I'm jealous.).

don

[Denny]

I dug up my BYO Rye issue and have some more info and questions.

First of all, Horst says you should always use Rye in conjunction with some Pale malt, so I figure I should add that to my grain bill. Denny, you say to take half of your Rye amt and add that much Pale. I can dig that.

My research shows that rye malt (at least Briess, which is the most common) probably has just barely enough diastatic power to convert itself. Given that, I think that 1/2 the rye amount given to pale is fine.

Horst talks about a multi temperature, multi step mash for all grain brewing, such as:
110 deg 20 min
122 deg 20 min
149 deg 45 min
158 deg 20 min.

Denny, you just recommend a steep/mash at 152 for 45 min. Is that adequate to convert the Rye, or should I do something to approximate Horst's suggestions? I mean, I could do his first 3 steps if you thought it would be a better approach.

As much as I respect Horst, that schedule just isn't necessary. I've NEVER done a step mash with rye and seldom do with wheat. Especially with the small amount of whaet in your converted recipe, I just don't see the need.

Also, Rye is smaller than barley malt, so do you think I will need to have the guys at NB adjust their mill to crush it? I guess I could run the Rye through and see if it gets crushed. I could ask them too.

Not knowing how their mill is set, I really couldn't say. I can tell you that I don't readjust my mill for rye, but I mill everything with a very narrow gap.

Denny your grain bill for your Rye Wit is:
2.75 lbs pale
2.25 lbs rye
2.25 lbs flaked soft white wheat
2.75 lbs wheat

Could you attempt a conversion of that to a 4 lb partial mash? I am planning on using some malt extract (see above). Also, your Tg of 1.049 is about what I'm shooting for.

Otherwise, going with what I have above, I could just do something like:

2 lbs Rye
1 lb Pale
.5 lbs Wheat Malt
.5 lbs Belgian Aromatic


I think that is it for now. Thanks for the help. (And it was cool to see a picture of you in the front of the mag. Oregon mountains, I'm jealous.).

don

Geez, the pic didn't scare you??? I'll run a conversion later when I have some time, but in general I think yours looks good.

[donosborn]

Well it's done. It's been in the keg for almost a couple weeks. It is still somewhat cloudy, and that is how I wanted it. I skipped the secondary and went right to the keg. I have a feeling it will clear up eventually.

The taste is good. The dry yeast I used worked well. I have not completely been able to detect what the Rye has added. I expect that with another more week or so the flavors will distinguish themselves. It might have a little bit of zip from the Rye but it's hard to tell with all the other normal Wit flavors.

Anyways, thanks again for the help.

[Denny]

Congrats, man! Makes me thirsty just looking at it!